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Thread: Hitbox and Models (Keel, Tankjr) ---- don't miss it

  1. #1
    Senior Member dom_prova is on a distinguished road
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    Hitbox and Models (Keel, Tankjr) ---- don't miss it

    edit: N.B.
    I noticed that in all pics, for perspective reasons (fire come a bit from bottom), the mini-cylinder lines are not totally accurate. my apologies for this.
    --------

    this is an empirical but accurate (errors 1 pixel) study about hitbox and how it fits to standard models:
    lets see frontal view of keel:
    http://img827.imageshack.us/i/1keelfrontal.jpg

    the hitbox on the models is excessively on the right.

    this is why many BELIEVE that an hit on the right side (while enemy moving to the left) is due to lag/ping.
    look how much space on the mini cylinder and the head !!!!

    frontal view of tankjr:
    http://img708.imageshack.us/i/1tankjrfrontal.jpg

    tankjr fits better the big cylinder except the arms.
    the head has same height of mini cylinder (at the least the fin) .... but still space.


    keel looking to the right:
    http://img146.imageshack.us/i/2keelright.jpg
    again too much space on the right, the head really unfits the mini-cylinder

    tankjr looking to the right:
    http://img585.imageshack.us/i/2tankjrright.jpg
    damn, there is some (a bit) out to the left, once again the right side has the void.
    the head fits on the left.
    better would be to move the hitbox z-axis to the left.

    keel looking left:
    3_keel-left.jpg
    aaarrrrrggghhhh!!!
    there is NOTHING to the right !!!! NOTHING !!!!
    even the right foot is pretty far by right....
    LOOK NOW WHERE YELLOW TRIANGLE POINTS .... OMG !!! the head at right
    3d effect ... that is back the head, the centrer of keel is on the back (remember first picture)

    tankjr looking left:
    3_tankjr-left.jpg
    yeah, it's almost perfect, if the hitbox be 3-5 pixels to the left would be best.
    the upper corners on mini-cylinders look very far by head, sad.
    the yellow triangle points in the right way.

    keel lateral view
    [IMG] http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/4...eellateral.jpg [/IMG]
    NO WAY !!
    this is the proof, the evidence that keel has bad hitbox axis!!!
    look the yellow triangle, it points back the head!
    see how much empty space there is back the model....
    this is why people says that netcode provide a lag help for railshots (confronted to q3a), so its better shoot a bit later
    hence it is not true, it's not netcode issue, it's model-hitbox bad coupling !!!!!

    now look how should look a better hitbox space:
    [IMG] http://img858.imageshack.us/img858/3...ateral20pi.jpg [/IMG]
    I manually moved 20 pixel to the left the drawing hitbox.
    now the axis pass through the head at perfect center.
    isn't it ?

    a comparison pic: the hitbox position as it is now and the proposal one.
    http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/6...alconfront.jpg

    i did the same for frontal view:
    [IMG] http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/641...frontal7px.jpg [/IMG]
    7 pixel to the left ... (more than 7 can be better IMHO)
    now you see the centerline passing over the keel's nose, as should be.
    the body looks more centered on the hitbox, no doubt.

    this pic compare versions on frontal view
    http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/6...frontal7px.jpg

    tankjr lateral view:
    http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/7374/tankjrlateral.jpg
    wow is almost perfect, but there is more space ahead than back, something on the back is out of hitbox
    the mini has that as weel, one fin is pretty out, where forward the head there is nothing.
    even here we can move the hitbox a bit forward compared to model, i moved 30 pixel the box:
    http://img854.imageshack.us/img854/3...tankjr30px.jpg
    the twos confronted:
    http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/4...alconfront.jpg
    i think its perfect, don't you?

    all angles for models

    keel:
    http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/1781/keelall.jpg

    tankjr:
    http://img862.imageshack.us/img862/2039/tankjrall.jpg

    and ...
    Visor !!!
    http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/5867/visorall.jpg
    visor fits good in most cases except when he looks to the left, but always better then keel in same position.

    now Sorlag:
    http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/306/sorlagall.jpg
    OMG, sorlag is so big, but not so bad... may be when g_playerModelScale 1.05 would be better.... dunno.

    this is Sarge:
    http://img840.imageshack.us/img840/5652/sargeall.jpg
    no way. this is out of hitbox center in any angle view but when he's looking left.

    Uriel:
    http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/9563/urielall.jpg (fixed link)
    oh, Uriel looks centered on his hitbox, may be should be more large like g_playerheadScale 1.15

    Crash:
    http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/2627/crashall.jpg
    this model is thin and a bit off-center.

    and now the horrible Orbb:
    http://img852.imageshack.us/img852/8856/orbball.jpg
    it's absolutely scandalous, outrageous and shameful
    may be nobody noticed that original developer was drunk

    now, one of the mostly successful model, Grunt:
    http://img852.imageshack.us/img852/1261/gruntall.jpg
    look how he fits very good, and how he looks no small in his cylinder,
    although he could be a bit enlarged, till shoulders touch the hitbox line.
    I hope for Grunt soon a bright version

    Biker:
    http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/3896/bikerall.jpg

    Bitterman:
    http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/5...ttermanall.jpg

    Bones:
    http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/9692/bonesall.jpg

    Doom:
    http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/9189/doomall.jpg
    oh! that is good, a little small, but good!
    enlarging till the shoulders touch the big cylinder would be very good.

    Hunter:
    http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/148/hunterall.jpg
    no, off-center and small.

    James:
    http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/4062/jamesall.jpg

    Janet:
    http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/4589/janetall.jpg

    Klesk:
    http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/6302/kleskall.jpg

    Lucy:
    http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/6402/lucyall.jpg

    Major:
    http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/7696/majorall.jpg
    thin model, but well centered

    Mynx:
    http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/9137/mynxall.jpg
    same as Major

    Ranger:
    http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/9494/rangerall.jpg
    a bit placed to the left in frontal view, it fits good elsewhere

    Razor:
    http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/4546/razorall.jpg
    I would move the hitbox a bit forward

    Xaero:
    http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/4461/xaeroall.jpg
    looks ok

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    That's all folks
    I hope ID Software will review models alignment at least for keel-tankjr-visor.

    another wonderful, easy and fast solution can be a new cvar:
    cg_hitboxOpacity 0 - 255
    variable from 0 (full transpacerncy) to 255 (full opacity) or
    cg_hitboxColor 0xRRGGBBaa
    (rgb+alpha, e.g. 0x00FF00FF for a green opaque and so on)
    think about this.

    enojy

    ------------ r_lodbias -----
    AFAIK
    r_lodbias = level of details bias, ( 0 = no bias, 2 = max bias )
    on the next jpg i placed
    model at 0 r_lodbias, model at 2 r_lodbias, model superimposed (!!!!),

    this is keel frontal view:
    http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/7...eltrittico.jpg
    look the superimposed one, no big differences

    tankjr:
    http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/298...jrtrittico.jpg
    omg tankjr fits better with r_lodbias 2

    visor:
    http://img858.imageshack.us/img858/8...ortrittico.jpg
    here the superimposition effect is more visible.

    lateral keel:
    http://img851.imageshack.us/img851/7...eltrittico.jpg
    rofl keel looks lost weight

    lateral tankjr:
    http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/2...jrtrittico.jpg
    definitively if there is tankjr must be r_lodbias 2

    lateral visor:
    http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/8...ortrittico.jpg
    visor is ok
    Last edited by dom_prova; 04-13-2011 at 08:55 PM. Reason: added some more pics

  2. #2
    Senior Member RAVESTYLE is on a distinguished road
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    there shud be a hitboxmodel

  3. #3
    Senior Member Cat has a spectacular aura about Cat has a spectacular aura about Cat's Avatar
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    TankJR has the most annoying sound, though. Can't stand seemingly having someone constantly spit in my ear.

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    /cg_forceenemymodel lucy

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    Senior Member vanBasten is on a distinguished road vanBasten's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOM_PROva_____ View Post
    http://img827.imageshack.us/i/1keelfrontal.jpg

    the hitbox on the models is excessively on the right.
    Is not excesive on the right, Keel uses his 2 arms for carry his gun, thats why his left arm dont match in the hit box, TankJr just use 1 arm thats why he match in the hitbox.
    "THE CHILI PEPPERS HAVE BABY APPEAL"

  6. #6
    Senior Member Adderall will become famous soon enough Adderall's Avatar
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    where did you get that picture?
    http://rog.asus.com/forum/member.php?38883-sectionate

    Amd 8350 - 4816.08 MHz on air
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    Asus GTX660 DirectCU

    Quote Originally Posted by Undertaker12 View Post
    Thank you. You're video is ok... you need a better cfg than that, and you should try using electronic songs like my movie.

  7. #7
    Senior Member KaasMan is on a distinguished road
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    Quote Originally Posted by vanBasten View Post
    Is not excesive on the right, Keel uses his 2 arms for carry his gun, thats why his left arm dont match in the hit box, TankJr just use 1 arm thats why he match in the hitbox.
    No, it's because TankJr is fat.

  8. #8
    Senior Member crucci is on a distinguished road
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    Quote Originally Posted by KaasMan View Post
    No, it's because TankJr is fat.
    Keel's hitbox isn't too much on the right. His torso is just too much on the left. Just look at his feet - they are well enough aligned with the hitbox, his torso just appears to be misaligned.

    Now it'd be interesting to see how the hitbox fit the model if the picture was taken from an angle perpendicular to the legs instead of the face.

  9. #9
    Senior Member dom_prova is on a distinguished road
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaVeStyLe View Post
    there shud be a hitboxmodel
    this will be my last consideration (or may be the first of all), my work is not yet finish

    Quote Originally Posted by Cat View Post
    TankJR has the most annoying sound, though. Can't stand seemingly having someone constantly spit in my ear.
    I too don't like tankjr sounds, but the worst is the thin difference between damaged sounds.

    Quote Originally Posted by vanBasten View Post
    Is not excesive on the right, Keel uses his 2 arms for carry his gun, thats why his left arm dont match in the hit box, TankJr just use 1 arm thats why he match in the hitbox.
    yes i will proof that keel has a misaligned hitbox, I did more pictures, look where the yellow triangle bottom point aims.
    anyway although your reply a player will never aim to the real center of hitbox from far. he will always aim a bit to the left.

    Quote Originally Posted by _adderall View Post
    where did you get that picture?
    I did 6 consecutive screeshoot from far after some tricks:

    devmap q3arenax (or any map)
    g_gametype 4 (clan arena)
    practiceflags 3
    map_restart
    join red
    give ammo
    addbot ranger 1 red
    cg_forceTeamModel Keel (o Tankjr)
    g_knockback 0
    weapon 6
    cg_fov 20
    sensitivity 0.5

    I moved linearly the mouse attacking by LG till i reach the hitbox border [here screenshot] x 6 times
    then I piled up the 6 pics with GIMP (photoeditor)
    at last i drawn the hitbox green lines.

    Quote Originally Posted by crucci View Post
    Keel's hitbox isn't too much on the right. His torso is just too much on the left. Just look at his feet - they are well enough aligned with the hitbox, his torso just appears to be misaligned.

    Now it'd be interesting to see how the hitbox fit the model if the picture was taken from an angle perpendicular to the legs instead of the face.
    I already said about keel, you know well how many time you hit keel with LG to the right side in blank space, this looks very cheaty-laggy-buggy.
    In Physics when your body move as keel, the gravity center moves as well. so hitbox still misaligned. (I have more proofs)

    yes, now another couple pics:

    keel looking to the right:
    http://img146.imageshack.us/i/2keelright.jpg
    again too much space on the right, the head really unfits the mini-cylinder

    tankjr looking to the right:
    http://img585.imageshack.us/i/2tankjrright.jpg/
    damn, there is some (a bit) out to the left, once again the right side has the void.
    the head fits on the left.
    better would be to move the hitbox z-axis to the left.

    [I will re-edit the first post adding this update]
    Last edited by dom_prova; 03-26-2011 at 10:58 PM.

  10. #10
    Senior Member xdc is on a distinguished road xdc's Avatar
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    take a look at this:
    http://xdcclan.com/screenshots/ql_new_hitbox.jpg
    now imagine the cylinder(blue) 10% wider

    even after update crash still fits perfectly in hitbox, but her
    animations are too weird(jump) etc

    we should get a better model other thank keel/tankjr, etc
    sarge, doom, & patriot would fit better
    Last edited by xdc; 03-21-2011 at 10:06 PM.

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